Weren’t we all invigorated by those 20 minute closing prayers at the Circuit Assemblies? I found it strange how so many otherwise down to earth brothers suddenly began to sound like Ted Koppel when speaking to Jehovah. I could just picture Jehovah sitting up there nodding politely and smiling the way all of us do when a child is chattering to us about his toy train.
Moses Unedited
JoinedPosts by Moses Unedited
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Elders / MS praying from the platform take to heart . . .
by bats in the belfry inw13-08-01, page 16. .
don't they pray for.
the fdsunity of congpeace of brotherhoodall the tiime?.
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Interesting Conversation that we ARE NOT Bible Students
by RubaDub inno need for all the details, but we were with a few from the kh after the meeting for some food and the topic of how smart we are compared to other religions in the world when it comes to knowing the bible.. my radar immediately went off as that is one of my pet peeves.
(most laughed since i doubt any do the family study night, but that's beside the point).
i asked one of the brothers to multiply that by 50 weeks (answer is 225 hours).
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Moses Unedited
ADCMS:
Of course, if they'd had their "Reasoning" books handy, they could've looked up why we can prove 1914 just from the Bible.
Maybe if the Watchtower is willing to develop a Reasoning Book app that can be used with the new Google Glasses, Witnesses won’t have to endure this embarrassment at the doors. Though, this could prove to be perilous should the app accidentally search the web for “Good Head” instead of “Godhead”.
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Is time running out for the Watchtower ? or has it already passed its used by date
by smiddy injudging by the titles/themes of the talks , dramas ,new releases ,tracts,brochures , etc,.i dont think their was anything that would enthuse any witness to renewed activity.on the contrary i think it would demoralize you .their was nothing their to inspire a new convert let alone one who has been in for decades to keep on in service to this organization.
for arguments sake ,i was baptised in 1961 if i was still in , at this convention ,i would be asking ,when is the great tribulatin to begin?
who is the king of the north ?
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Moses Unedited
I think OnTheWayOut is pretty much right about the very slow death. The Watchtower organization is a little bit like the Sears Roebuck of religious denominations: a household name with a long history, but with little relevance anymore. Many other churches (particularly the mega churches) are much more in tune with what benefit the lives of people (i.e. providing youth programs, support groups for single parents, etc.). What does the Watchtower organization provide? Literature. And of course, tedious meetings where that literature is read, retained, and recited. Sound very inspiring? Not to most people.
True, the Watchtower is still experiencing some growth. But, the growth they are experiencing in Western lands is essentially the “sloppy seconds” of the populace that has either not been picked up by the other denominations, or the kind of people who are attracted to apocalyptic beliefs. The organization will still crawl along, dragging it’s indoctrinated faithful, the same way that a horrible ball team still retains its core fan base.
I have no doubt that the Watchtower will still be around for a long time to come. The simple reason is that there is still a market for their beliefs. Why do I say this? Notice how many people still buy lottery tickets.
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What tactics do the Witnesses get the worldly people curious?
by Iamallcool ini will tell you one, i do remember one brother that was doing some street work, he was standing while he only showed the very back page of the magazines and his tactic did work more than you think and they asked him what the magazine was all about.
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Moses Unedited
Remember the talking point that involved asking householders if they ever wondered why certain turtles lived to be 150 years old while man only lived 70 to 80 years? That must have taken some sap in the writing department a few weeks and several pots of coffee to develop. Rather sophomoric, but at least it was enough to coax lonely old ladies to agree to a return visit.
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DF ones can now choose where to sit...New WT Policy
by Quarterback inaug wt q and a has now stated that any df'd person can sit with anyone, anywhere at a congregation meeting.. before, they had to sit at the back of the hall.
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Moses Unedited
Wow, the Watchtower is really liberalizing isn’t it? I think the Watchtower just may be on the verge of easing the one paper towel rule at the conventions. Maybe; and this is just a maybe . . . . . people will soon be allowed to sit down during the convention announcements regarding the proper use of the recycle bins.
“Friends, with these new adjustments; does it not excite us to be a part of Jehovah’s progressive organization, and to see his chariot on the move?”
[ thunderous applause ]
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Interesting Conversation that we ARE NOT Bible Students
by RubaDub inno need for all the details, but we were with a few from the kh after the meeting for some food and the topic of how smart we are compared to other religions in the world when it comes to knowing the bible.. my radar immediately went off as that is one of my pet peeves.
(most laughed since i doubt any do the family study night, but that's beside the point).
i asked one of the brothers to multiply that by 50 weeks (answer is 225 hours).
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Moses Unedited
I kept the tone very soft but I just mentioned that other than the core beliefs from the GB, how many in the KH can prove one of our fundamental beliefs, such as 1914, directly from the Bible? Everyone just smiled.
LOL. I remember how typical this was; particularly when having to cover this kind of material in the home book studies. I remember having to conduct a book study when we were covering the Revelation Climax book, and it was like pulling teeth to get anyone to comment. We were covering some very important doctrines that were exclusive to JWs and very few people in the group could provide an answer that was not an almost ver batim reading of the material that we had just read. I myself scratched my head at many of the labyrinthine arguments put forth in the book. The closing prayer couldn’t have come sooner.
Yet, whenever a study article would cover the machinations of the Christendom (especially the Catholic Church), you couldn’t shut people up. Hands would fly up like it was an art auction. JWs can provide very articulate answers on what the Catholics have gotten wrong. But, here is an interesting experiment: ask a JW at your door to show you FROM THE BIBLE, where it teaches that salvation comes through an earthly channel, or to justify having to be baptized in association with an organization. “I will have to get back to you on that one” is the likely response, so that they can go consult their Talmud (the Watchtower CD-rom).
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Symposium: Beware of Apostates! - 'God's Word is Truth!' District Convention of Jehovah's Witnesses 2013 - not on JW.ORG
by mindnumbed insymposium: beware of apostates!.
satanhuman apostates also of interest ..... the truth brings "not peace, but a sword" .
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Moses Unedited
If we do what is good, there is no reason to be afraid of the demons. Jesus is stronger than they are, and they are afraid of him. One day the demons cried out to Jesus: “Did you come to destroy us?”
A modern day rendition of this might read: "Google is stronger than they are, and they are afraid of it. One day the Governing Body cried out to the internet: "Did you come to discredit us?"
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Symposium: Beware of Apostates! - 'God's Word is Truth!' District Convention of Jehovah's Witnesses 2013 - not on JW.ORG
by mindnumbed insymposium: beware of apostates!.
satanhuman apostates also of interest ..... the truth brings "not peace, but a sword" .
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Moses Unedited
Steve2 wrote:
There are few things as threatening to the authority of the GB as people who are beginning to see through the veneer of hypocritical religiosity. Harp on, threaten and stir up fear all you like, servants of the GB, but your plastic spirituality and bogus claims to Truth melt under the scrutiny of clear-eyed thinking.
Yes, I would say that the proverbial writing on the wall for these Watchtower leaders is in the form of the Google search engine. The organization is already filled with people who are burned out, discouraged, and harboring secret doubts. The GB’s continual cracking of the whip and chest beating over “apostates” is only going to give these people more of a nudge to begin doing their own investigating of their religion. It is hard to believe that the Watchtower writing department could be so profoundly stupid.
I did not need "apostates" to open my eyes to the corruption that was staring me right in the face. Yet, equally, there is no denying that countless others have been disturbed enough to investigate their own legitimate doubts and misgivings and have reached fairly similar conclusions
This was also the case with me as well Steve. I began my investigations of the Jehovah’s Witnesses beliefs at my local public library; and my research DID NOT include reading any ex-Witness materials! I wanted to do my own thinking without any biased opinions muddying up the waters. I came to the conclusion that the Watchtower was wrong on many fronts and made the decision to leave long before I ever heard of people like Randy Watters of M. James Penton! Surprisingly, when I finally did talk with other ex-Witnesses, they only shared the same experience that I had myself! This totally refutes the Watchtower’s claims that “apostates” deceive people into leaving the organization. This is a pure straw man argument they are using.
HarryMac wrote:
Well, in my case, years of bound volumes, meetings, studies, talks, etc... slipped away with the reading of 'In Search of Christian Freedom'.
One book! Actually, I was mentally out before even being half done. That's powerful. GB kryptonite!
Great point Harry. If the “Truth” is so supreme and from the mouth of God himself, how is it that it can be so easily deconstructed with a single book? For example, Most of Sir Isaac Newton’s published findings have stood the test of time - for hundreds of years! How could the teachings from Jehovah’s very mouth have to be discarded after only a few decades?
What rational person would read the New Testament and interpret Jesus’ words to be applying to some publishing organization if they had not been indoctrinated to believe so? What intelligent person would read the Old Testament, and liken Moses and Aaron to a modern group of old men who run the Jehovah’s Witness religion if someone had not indoctrinated them to think so?
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So, The Entire Governing Body Could Go Apostate?
by metatron ini made an effort to plow thru the latest bullsh*t from the wts in regard to the faithful slave, etc.
i must admit that, their latest set of interpretations make more sense than formerly.
they seem to have done away with 4-6 different 'comings' of jesus and they pretty much stuck everything in the future, so they are off the hook in the present.
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Moses Unedited
Freddy Franz’s now infamous talk at the Gilead Graduation, where he argued against the concept of a central governing body was probably the most (or only) rational idea he ever expressed. From a Biblical perspective, he was spot on. However, the organizational machinery rolled on and squashed that in a hurry. No cult can be effective without centralized authoritarians.
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Apostate Symposium 2013 San Diego District Convention
by problemaddict insorry i did not get audio.
too much going on around me that would give me away anyways.
i think someone posted audio, but it is different from what i heard on some levels.
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Moses Unedited
This is what you get from an organization that doesn’t have any good ideas left. These kinds of sophomoric clichés are the kind of messaging that is given to small children, not rational adults.
This is no doubt timed to coincide with the most recent Watchtower article dealing with the changes in the Faithful Slave doctrine. The teaching committee and the writing department know this is going to cause some skeptical head-scratching; in the same way the 1995 “Generation” change was put into print. They know that some ex-Witnesses will be bringing up the topic of the “Faithful Slave selection” to Witnesses at the doors. These kinds of talks only serve to reinforce and maintain the siege mentality that they’ve inculcated in their members.
When the recent doctrinal change is brought up to Witnesses, most of them will reason: “Wow! The organization just reminded us about this danger! This criticism is coming from Satan. I’m so grateful for the spiritual armor the organization provides us!” In this way, the average Witness does not even have to give any thought to the points being raised. They can simply dismiss it as “apostate ideas”.
When you read Steven Hassan’s book: “Combatting Cult Mind Control”, it is astounding how much of those tactics the Watchtower leadership uses on its members. As I wrote in another thread, the Watchtower is pretty much out of ideas. All of the old predictions and ideas of their “oracles” Russell, Rutherford, and Franz have failed miserably. They might be able to get some traction out of the 2034 date, but that’s 20 years off. They need to keep the members in control right now. The internet has done incredible damage to their ability to mold and shape reality, and it will only get worse for the Watchtower. This isn’t 1970 anymore. Members who have doubts can instantly begin to investigate their beliefs via the mobile device right there in their pocket.
Google is a cult’s worst nightmare. How do they even begin to battle that? They put on grandiose and pompous symposiums where they beat their chests and childishly denounce all dissent with childish clichés and slogans. A very feeble, losing strategy indeed!